Legislature(2005 - 2006)HOUSE FINANCE 519

02/28/2005 01:30 PM House FINANCE


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* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
HB 35 EXTEND BD ARCHITECTS/ENGINEERS/SURVEYORS
Heard & Held
* HB 66 APPROP: MENTAL HEALTH BUDGET
Bill Postponed
* HB 67 APPROP: OPERATING BUDGET/LOANS/FUNDS/CBR
Bill Postponed
HB 97 OATHS; NOTARIES PUBLIC; STATE SEAL
Heard & Held
HB 99 CRIMES INVOLVING CONTROLLED SUBSTANCES
Heard & Held
Bills Previously Heard/Scheduled
= HB 134 SUPPLEMENTAL APPROPRIATIONS/CBR
Bill Postponed
HOUSE BILL NO. 97                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
     An  Act  relating  to  the   authority  to  take  oaths,                                                                   
     affirmations,  and  acknowledgments  in  the  state,  to                                                                   
     notarizations, to verifications,  to acknowledgments, to                                                                   
     fees  for  issuing certificates  with  the  seal of  the                                                                   
     state  affixed, and  to notaries  public; and  providing                                                                   
     for an effective date.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
SCOTT  CLARK,  NOTARY  ADMINISTRATOR,  OFFICE  OF  LIEUTENANT                                                                   
GOVERNOR, voiced  support for the legislation  and asked that                                                                   
Mr. Westad, intern for Lt. Governor Leman summarize it.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
BRIAN WESTAD,  INTERN, OFFICE OF LIEUTENANT  GOVERNOR, stated                                                                   
that HB 97  identifies changes in the Alaska  Statutes, which                                                                   
have not  been updated since 1961.   These changes  have been                                                                   
suggested by the  Alaskan Notaries working together  with Lt.                                                                   
Governor Leman's office.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Mr. Westad referenced the handout:  Notary Statute Comparison                                                                   
-  CSHB  97 (JUD).    (Copy  in  File).   The  comparison  is                                                                   
arranged in sections highlighting  the qualifications, terms,                                                                   
fees, bonds, commission types,  commission revocation, notary                                                                   
data and non-commissioned notaries.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
Mr. Westad provided an overview of the handout.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
2:21:23 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Mr. Westad continued with the overview.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
2:22:11 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Croft  was  confused how  the  procedure  for                                                                   
revocation  changes.   He  referenced the  proposed  "shared"                                                                   
responsibility with the Lt. Governor.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
Mr. Clark  responded that Section  68, Page 16,  provides the                                                                   
Lt.  Governor   the  authority  to  revoke  or   suspend  the                                                                   
commission  based on  grounds for  that subsection.   If  the                                                                   
status for the notary changes  and they no longer qualify for                                                                   
the commission,  that would constitute  grounds.   An extreme                                                                   
case  would be  a notary  convicted  of a  felony during  the                                                                   
course  of their  commission.   Failure  to  comply with  the                                                                   
chapter gives  the Lt.  Governor the  authority to  revoke or                                                                   
suspend.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Mr. Clark pointed out that the  #3 category for "incompetence                                                                   
or  malfeasance"  is more  nebulous.    All the  changes  are                                                                   
fairly technical and relate to the legislation itself.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Mr. Clark noted that Section 44.50.069  deals with situations                                                                   
where the public might call and  complain about a notary.  In                                                                   
that  situation,  instead  of  the Lt.  Governor  having  the                                                                   
authority to revoke  the commission, it would  go through the                                                                   
Office  of   Administrative  hearings.     He  thought   that                                                                   
situation  could  be  less defined  and  would  require  some                                                                   
degree of investigation.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
2:24:59 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative Croft referenced  that section and asked about                                                                   
the final  analysis and determination  of a violation  in the                                                                   
chapter.  He  stated that Section 44.50.068  surprised him in                                                                   
that it repeats Section 44.50.069  and gives the Lt. Governor                                                                   
the  sole power.   He  pointed  out that  language would  not                                                                   
require a hearing.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
Mr. Clark acknowledged  that was correct and that  it was not                                                                   
intended to "rob" the notaries  of their right to appeal.  He                                                                   
thought  it  might be  appropriate  to  add a  subsection  to                                                                   
Section 44.50.068  that would  clarify that the  notary would                                                                   
have the  authority to  appeal any decision  made by  the Lt.                                                                   
Governor.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
Representative Croft  thought that the two  provisions should                                                                   
be combined  into one section.   As  it appears now,  the two                                                                   
seem  to  be on  different  tracks.    Mr. Clark  agreed  and                                                                   
suggested that Representative  Croft could make an amendment,                                                                   
which their office  would support.  The current  situation is                                                                   
quite  cumbersome.   He  suggested that  if  an amendment  is                                                                   
created, it should approach the  situation by letting the Lt.                                                                   
Governor suspend or revoke and  then using the administrative                                                                   
hearing officer to become the appeal mechanism.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
2:28:16 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Croft  commented it  should  be  a matter  of                                                                   
suspending.  Mr. Clark agreed.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Hawker agreed  with Representative  Croft and                                                                   
thought that  an amendment should  be brought  forward before                                                                   
the bill was moved from Committee.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
Representative Weyhrauch  recommended that if  there is going                                                                   
to be an appeal, it should be  in a separate section applying                                                                   
to other provisions.  Mr. Clark  asked if direction was being                                                                   
given  for  the  Office  of the  Lt.  Governor  to  draft  an                                                                   
amendment.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Weyhrauch asked  about the qualifications  of                                                                   
the  notary.    He  referenced   Section  8,  Page  8,  which                                                                   
stipulates  the  qualifications  of  those  not  having  been                                                                   
incarcerated  for  a  felony   within  10  years  before  the                                                                   
commission takes effect.  He asked  if a person would qualify                                                                   
if  they  were  convicted  of  a  felony  but  had  not  been                                                                   
incarcerated.  Mr. Clark did not know if it was possible.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
2:30:32 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Weyhrauch  commented  that  if you  choose  a                                                                   
notary, you choose  someone that can be trusted.   He thought                                                                   
that a  probation felon  should be  reconsidered.   Mr. Clark                                                                   
replied that it  had not occurred to them that  someone could                                                                   
be  accused  of  a  felony  and  not  be  incarcerated.    He                                                                   
recommended  establishing  language   that  would  take  both                                                                   
situations into consideration.   Mr. Clark agreed it could be                                                                   
addressed at the same time as the other amendment.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
2:31:50 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair Meyer pointed  out that the application  fee had not                                                                   
been changed;  he asked if  it had been  the same  cost since                                                                   
1961.  Mr. Clark responded that  fee had been raised from $20                                                                   
dollars to  $40 dollars in  1990.  The  Lt. Governor  did not                                                                   
proposed that a change be made to that number.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
In response to Representative  Weyhrauch's comments regarding                                                                   
the fees,  Mr. Clark  explained that the  $40 dollar  fee was                                                                   
reasonable compared with other states.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Weyhrauch questioned the  cost to buy  a bond                                                                   
in 1990  as compared  to now.   Mr. Clark  did not  know, but                                                                   
guessed that they had not increased.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
Representative   Weyhrauch  asked  if   a  notary   test  was                                                                   
required.   Mr.  Clark replied  that  the test  is no  longer                                                                   
required;  when  researching   the  statutes,  there  was  no                                                                   
statutory  authority  to  make  it mandatory.    The  changes                                                                   
proposed to  HB 97 intends to  expand the testing  program to                                                                   
make it self guided through the website.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Weyhrauch  asked  it was  required  that  the                                                                   
notaries keep  a log.   Mr. Clark replied  that law  does not                                                                   
require it, but notaries are strongly  urged to keep a notary                                                                   
journal.   He added that  it is an  essential element  to the                                                                   
act of notarization.  It is not  mentioned in the statutes or                                                                   
in the bill and  is a contentious subject.  There  has been a                                                                   
lot of objection  to a mandatory journal.   He commented that                                                                   
a journal serves the public's  best interest as it provides a                                                                   
record of important information.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
2:36:07 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Hawker  referenced  the  $40 dollar  fee  and                                                                   
asked if  the State was  receiving sufficient revenue  to run                                                                   
the  cost  of  the  program with  that  amount.    Mr.  Clark                                                                   
believed so.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair Meyer  interjected that since the legislation  is in                                                                   
the  process of  raising  the fees,  that  section should  be                                                                   
"bumped up"  a little.  Mr.  Clark responded that if  the fee                                                                   
was  raised, the  bill  might  not pass.    He stressed  that                                                                   
passage is important and that  the Office of the Lt. Governor                                                                   
had looked at the fee schedule closely.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
2:37:46 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative Holm asked if it  might be called a tax on the                                                                   
notary.   He  inquired about  the  number of  notaries.   Mr.                                                                   
Clark  stated   that  their  office  processes   about  3,000                                                                   
commissions  each  year  and that  there  are  around  12,000                                                                   
active notaries.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
Vice-Chair  Stoltze  asked  if  any  industry  dominates  the                                                                   
notary  commissions.   Mr.  Clark  replied that  the  banking                                                                   
industry is a  common business; however, all  businesses find                                                                   
it convenient to have notaries on staff.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Vice-Chair  Stoltze asked  if banks  offer the  service as  a                                                                   
convenience or as  a service.  Mr. Clark responded  that most                                                                   
banks  offer   notary  services  free  of  charge   to  their                                                                   
customers.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Croft referenced  the $40  dollar charge  and                                                                   
asked if that  fee had been too  high in 1990.   He suggested                                                                   
that the  question should be  if the amount generates  enough                                                                   
money to  cover the services and  asked if it  was comparable                                                                   
to other states.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair Meyer  stated he  would not  suggest an increase  if                                                                   
costs were being met.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
Representative   Weyhrauch  thought   it  was  important   to                                                                   
scrutinize  those  costs  closely  and  requested  that  more                                                                   
information be made available.   Mr. Clark offered to provide                                                                   
that information.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair  Meyer requested  that Mr. Clark  work with  Suzanne                                                                   
Cunningham in  his office to  provide a committee  substitute                                                                   
addressing the items of concern.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair Chenault  inquired if  there was a  log of  how many                                                                   
times a notary uses their seal  each year.  Mr. Clark replied                                                                   
that without a notary journal,  there is no way to track that                                                                   
type of activity.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair Chenault  questioned the  fiscal note request.   Mr.                                                                   
Clark advised  that the  fees referenced  are not related  to                                                                   
the notaries  or the public.   They are related to  a special                                                                   
type of certificate,  attached to documents going  to foreign                                                                   
countries.    Foreign  governments   often  will  not  accept                                                                   
documents  from  any  other  country  without  that  type  of                                                                   
attached certificate.   There are between 2,000  and 3,000 of                                                                   
those per  year and  that is  what the  fiscal note  is based                                                                   
upon.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair Chenault  asked what  most of the certificates  deal                                                                   
with.    Mr.  Clark  explained  that  they  verify  that  the                                                                   
notaries really are notaries.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
2:43:59 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
HB 97 was HELD in Committee for further consideration.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                

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